Nuncio Pascal Robinson to Prior

Typed account of a conversation with the Nuncio in which he advises against the formation of a congregation, saying it will not get the approval of the Bishops. He advises to form lay society instead.

AI CLEANED AND TRANSLATED:

Mercredi [date unclear, likely 1937]
Conversation à la Nonciature. Mgr Bearzotti présent et approuvant.
Résumé, Non Historique, mais Logique.

Le Nonce commence par dire et tout le temps il parle avec cette "autorité" : " Voici ce que je pense et vous conseille comme Nonce : vous ferez ce que vous voudrez, mais ceci est mon Avis formel et définitif.

Vous ne trouverez jamais un Évêque en Irlande. Pas même Cork. Je l'ai vu à Maynooth et il s'est dérobé—pas non plus Kilmore (M.M. est payée pour le savoir !).
[Et il pense, sans le dire, que lui-même ne peut rien pour elle tant qu'elle est en Irlande, mais qu'il pourra l'aider puissamment une fois dehors—i.e. en Afrique.]

Même si Cork acceptait, retirez-vous. Entre les mains d'un Évêque, votre œuvre sera dénaturée. Les "bonae religiosae" choisies par lui changeront tout : l'esprit sera transformé, si l'œuvre n'est pas détournée de son premier but—cf. Killeshandra.
(i.e. tout Évêque prendrait son rôle de diocésain comme s'il était fondateur, et entendrait tout régler à sa façon.)

Alors, quitter Glenstal ? Oui. D'ailleurs il sera toujours impossible, avec nos Évêques, de vous former en congrégation bénédictine : ils n'accepteront jamais.
Je comprends que les Évêques sont jaloux de toute ingérence. Les religieuses relevant plus ou moins directement d'un Ordre d'hommes échappent à leur influence, et leur action est paralysée—Quand bien même elles n'obtiendraient pas l'exemption.

Constituez-vous donc en Société laïque (ce fut d'ailleurs l'avis de S.E. dès le début des difficultés). Les Évêques ne pourront rien contre vous. Une maison à Dublin pour grouper les Aspirantes et tenir les Étudiantes. En ce moment vos filles sont à l'abandon—et elles vont se perdre.

Envoyez le plus tôt possible un peloton en Afrique, et, là, trouvez un Évêque qui vous donne maison, noviciat, etc.
Vous aurez des difficultés—en particulier financières—mais il faut aller de l'avant. Dans la voie où vous êtes, vous ne pouvez que piétiner.

Rentrée le 10, M.M. [Mother Mary] écrit au Nonce la lettre dont copie ci-jointe.
English Translation

Wednesday [Date Code]
Conversation at the Nunciature. Mgr Bearzotti present and approving.
Summary, not chronological, but logical.

The Nuncio begins by saying—and all the while he speaks with this "authority": "Here is what I think and counsel you as Nuncio: you will do what you wish, but this is my formal and definitive Opinion."

You will never find a Bishop in Ireland. Not even Cork. I saw him at Maynooth and he evaded [the issue]—nor Kilmore either (M.M. has paid the price to know that!).
[And he thinks, without saying it, that he himself can do nothing for her as long as she is in Ireland, but that he will be able to help her powerfully once outside—i.e., in Africa.]

Even if Cork were to accept, withdraw. In the hands of a Bishop, your work will be distorted. The "bonae religiosae" [good religious women] chosen by him will change everything: the spirit will be transformed, if the work is not diverted from its primary goal—cf. Killeshandra.
(i.e., every Bishop would take his role as diocesan as if he were the founder, and would intend to regulate everything in his own way.)

So, leave Glenstal? Yes. Besides, it will always be impossible, with our Bishops, to form you into a Benedictine congregation: they will never accept it.
I understand that the Bishops are jealous of any interference. Nuns reporting more or less directly to an Order of men escape their influence, and their [the Bishops'] action is paralyzed—Even if they [the nuns] were not to obtain exemption.

Constitute yourselves therefore as a Lay Society (this was indeed the opinion of His Excellency from the beginning of the difficulties). The Bishops will be unable to do anything against you. [Get] a house in Dublin to group the Aspirants and keep the Students. At this moment your daughters are abandoned—and they are going to be lost.

Send as soon as possible a detachment to Africa, and, there, find a Bishop who gives you a house, novitiate, etc.
You will have difficulties—particularly financial—but you must go forward. In the path where you are, you can only mark time [stagnate].

Returned on the 10th, M.M. [Mother Mary] wrote to the Nuncio the letter of which a copy is attached.

ORIGINAL OCR

mercredi a/91a9
1o13-o)2e M7e
Conwersatior a la Monciature Migc Bearzotti prasent et appr.
Rasume, Hon Historidue,mais Logique.
Me Monce commence par dire et tout le temps il parle avec
cette "autorita' -.oici ce que ie pense et wous ccnscule
comme Monce: wous feres ce Que wous woudrez,mais ceci est mor
Avis formel et dAfipitif.

1. Yous me trouverez jamais un Eweque ep Mrlande. fas meme
   Cork. ie Mai wu a Maynooth et id s'est ddrobt - pas non plue
   Kilmore C'.M.est payte pour le savoiri3
   Let il pense,gans le dire,due Mui-meme ne peut rien poum
   elle tant Qudelde est en Irlande,mais du'id pourra M'a
   der puissamment une fois dehors - i.e.en Afrique.
2. Meme si Corlt acceptait retirezLvous.Eatre 1s mains J'uol
   Epus,wotre oeuvre sera ddnaturde. Les "bonae religiosae'choi
   sies par lui changeront tou:lesprit sera transforme, si
   1oeuvre niest pas detournde de son premier but - cf Kile-
   Shandra,
   i.e. tout wps prendrait son role de diocisaip comme
   S'id etait fondateur,et enterdrait tout rigler d sa fao
3. Alors,quitter Glenstal 2 Oui. 'ailleurs il sera touioure
   impossible,avec nos Eps de wous former en consregation bine
   dictine:ils piaccepteront iamais.
   Me comprends que les Epe sont jalouY de toute ingErence
   Jes religieuses relevant plus ou moins directement d'un
   Jrdre d'hommes Achappent a ieur influence,et leut actio
   M est paralyste - Quand A eldes nobtiendraient pas L
   exemption.
   A. Constituez-wous donc ep Socittt latque (co fut dioiidourg
   1'avis de S.E. dds me dabut des difficultesd Les Eps ne pon
   ront rien contre wous. Une maisor a Dublin po r gcouper Les
   Aspirantes et tenir les Ctudiantes.En ce momeat wos fildes
   Sont S l'abandon - at elles wont se perdre.
   Ewovez le plus tot possibie up peloton en Afridue,et,1d,
   trouwvez up Eps,qui wous donbe maison,nowiciat,etc.
   wous aurez des difficultis - en patticulier financieres - mo
   1d faut alder de l'avant. Dans la woie od wous etes,vous ne
   pouvez que pictiner.
   Rentrse le 10, M.M.ecrit au Hence la lettre dont copie ci-
   Jointe

Short note of acknowledgment to Prior and offering prayers for his Mother.

Note about Glenstal, the Sisters and Msgr Shanahan. Language is French.

AI TRANSLATION AND CLEANUP:

She is in danger through conversations with Mgr. Shanahan. She received her midwifery qualifications at Holles Street and went to join Mgr. Shanahan in Africa in 1921. She was accompanied by—or met there—a Sister of Charity with whom she worked. However, circumstances rather confined her to teaching work, for which she did not feel suited, nor did she believe she was called. Mgr. Shanahan returned to Europe and went to Rome to present his views (a long conversation with the Pope, Miss Martin told me). The Pope highly approved. The best way, he suggested, was to do her novitiate in Africa. So she began, under the direction of the aforementioned Sister of Charity. Six months later, a cable from Mgr. Shanahan called her back to Ireland, saying, "Come and join the Dominicans." So she returned in 1924. A society was being formed. The ideal was not quite the same; as proof, they turned to the Dominicans, reputed for better intellectual training for teaching. Miss Martin was reluctant to join the three or four who were starting, under the guidance of some Dominicans. Mgr. Shanahan insisted, she obeyed. Two or three times during this trial, she expressed the desire to withdraw. Finally, she left. 1925-1926, she had spent a year there. The increasingly educational orientation of Killesh gradually made Mgr. Shanahan lose all influence over the foundation. After a new attempt in an institute dedicated to medical care—I have no details on the nature of the work. I know that this new society was founded in Scotland (Glasgow) with a view towards Missions.

ORIGINAL OCR TEXT
danger par conversations avec Mgr Shanahan. Elle prend ses
diplomes d'accoucheuse a MHolles Steet et va rejoindre Mgr
Sh. en Afrique. 1921.
E1 Ml e etait accomoagnee - ou rencontra la bas une Soeur
de Charite avec laquelle elle travailla. Mais les circonstan
ces la confinerent plutot dans le travail d'enseignement-
pour lequel elle ne se sentait pas faite - ni ne se vroyait
Appelee.
3 Mgr Sh.rentre en Burope,et va exposer a Rome (1ong ent
tretien avec le Pape,me dit Miss Martin) ses vues. Le Pape
Approuve hautement. Le meilleur moyen,suggere-t-il,est de
faire son nsviciat en Afrique. Elle commence donc,sous le di
rection de la susdite Sr de Charite.
Ge A) Six mois apres,un cable de Mgr Sh.la rappelle en 1T
Lande."Come & ioin the Dominican' Elle rentre. 1924.
Une societe se formait.L'ideal n'etait pas tout a fait le
meme; comme preuve, on s'etait adresse aux Dominicaines, pcq
en reputation de meilleure formation intellectuelle pour 1'e)
seignement. Mis M.repugnait a gni se joindre aux trois ou qus
tre qui Commencaient,sous 1a conduite de quelqucs Dominicaine
Mgr Sh.insista,clle obeit. Deux ou trois fois,au cours de ce
te eprauve,elle manifesta le desir de se retirer. Finalment,
clle sort.1925-1926Klle y avait passe un an 3.
L'orientation de plus en pbus educayionnale de Killesh.
fit d'ailleurs peu a peu perdre a Mgr Sh.toute influence sur
la fondation.
5) Rau apres nouvel essai dans un institut consacre aux
soins medicaux - je n'ai pas de details sur la nature de 1
oeuvre. Je sais que c'etait en Acosse (Glasgow) que cette nol
velle socicte s'etait fondee- en vue des Missions. Elle y

Short note from Bishop John Harty, sent from the Royal Marine hotel, saying that he would be happy to confirm the boys in Glenstal, and confirming that Mother Mary Martin would not be allowed to establish her congregation in his diocese at Glenstal.

...

Advice from C. Heerey C.S.S.P. about coming to Nigeria

AI CLEANED TEXT

My dear Sister Mary,

I hope you will pardon me for my long delay in replying to your most welcome letter last Xmas. It was a very great happiness to hear from you again and to hear such good reports on your work. I hope Our Dear Lord will continue to bless your little company till He sees it in the midst of the active life of the missionary world. I was expecting your second letter as promised and this partly explains my delay. As yet I do not know much about your position, but I take it that you are the nucleus of a great Medical Missionary Body, a body which my experience of this Mission has taught me is a very great need. There is nothing I would appreciate more than to have a body of Religious women who are qualified and authorized to run a Medical Mission in all its aspects and details.

You probably have heard of some of my experiences of these experiments of the Medical Missions run by a combination of Religious and lay people. With all the good will in the world on both sides, the position is fraught with many delicacies and difficulties. Anua has had its baptism of trials—trials is hardly the word—Satan's vendetta would be more suitable! Emekuku has also had its share, but the difficulties are in great part surmounted. I am blessed in having there an excellent doctor who puts the Mission work before any personal inconvenience.

The ideal thing would be a Society such as yours to take over every aspect of the Medical Mission—doctors and nurses all of one mind, with one common purpose and one common obedience. I could enter into many details, but I do not care to write them. If I were talking to you I would speak more freely. But I am convinced that your Society is the ideal one for a Medical Mission. I wish your Society every blessing and hope its members will grow rapidly and that you and your daughters will spread to many Missions and do immense work for souls through your medical labours.

Our celebrations of the golden Jubilee of the Mission and of the opening of the Cathedral were a great success. I am sorry I have not any snaps to send you. Miss Powell and Miss D'Arc[y] had been working in Emekuku Hospital since they came out till the beginning of Feb. They are two fine girls. I am sorry they have no doctor to work with them. I hope they will get one soon.

God bless you, I hope you will write again and tell me more of the society. Don't forget me in your prayers please.

Yours v. sincerely in J.C.

C. Heerey C.S.Sp.

ORIGINAL OCR

My dear sister Mary.
I hope you will pardon me for my long delay
in replying to you most welcome letter last Kmas. It sas a
Very great happiness to hear from you again amd to hear such
good reports on your work. I hope Our Dear Lord will continue
to bless your little company till He sces it in the midst of the
Active life of the missionary world. I was expecting you second
Letter as promised and this partly explains my delay. Ad yet I
do not know much about your position, but I take it that you are
she nucleus of a great Medical Missionary Body. a body which m
experience of this of this Mission has taught me is a very great
73
need, There is nothing I would appreciate more than to have a
body of Religious momen who are qualified and authorized to run
A Medical Mission in all its aspects and details.
Younprobably have heard of some of my experiences of these
experiments of the Medical Missions run by a combination of Re-
Ligious and lay people. With all the good will in the world on
both sides, the position is fraugth with many delicacies and dit.
ficulties. anwa has had its baptism of trails- trails is hardly
the word- satan's vendella would be more suitable' Emeluku.
has also had its share, but the difficulties are in great parts
surmounted. I am blessed in having there an excellent doctor who
puts the Mission work before any personal inconvienience.
The ideal thing would be a Society such as yours to take
over every aspect of the Medical Mission - doctors and nurses all
of one mind, with one common purpose and one common obedience,
I could enter into many delails, but I do not care to write
them. 1f I were talking to you I would speak more freely. But
I am convinced that your Society is the idial one for A Medscal
Mission. I wish your Society every blessing and hope its members
will grow rapidly and that you and your daughters will spread to
many Missions and do immense work for souls through your medical
Labours.
Aur celebrations of the golden Jubilee of the M
R
CAHOLIG, MisszoN
ONITSHLA.
SOUTHER MIGERIA.

Caritas
Dear Father Prior
Many many thanks for your letter of
New Years day +returning I.
Letter so promptly.
Ishall deal with all that relates to
Glenstal + the reopening of The College first
Iwrote to Miss Leydon to return to Glenstal
on Monday the 17th if she has any difficultie
about which she wishes to see me to come
by 9.15Am train to Dublin, she ought to
catch the 5 pm to Limerick, if Ohe does
not need to see me, she may go direct to
Glenstal. I told her to find out cheapest
route.
It would be well for Mary to have fires
set in Dormitories, + if possible have the floors
waxed + teachers. rooms + Matrons in order.
Cook says she can spare Mary_
Mai will have plenty of time to have
her department in order.
Matron wrote me a very good letter, she seems
Epiphany Sunday
1935.

full of joy and energy for the next term.
I shall certainly send a companion to Miss
Leyden- but ir will not be for a few weeks.
If I send Miss O' Rourke it means she must
give up her office + resign_ she will have to give
them a couple of weeks notice. She ofcarse is the
only one of the four earning and unless things
were very definite as to he possibility of
continuing at Glenstal to would be very unwise
for her to resign. On the other hand if they
have a fairly regular life + start religious
instructions on the vows, she will be one of
the ones that would benefit most from them

• would be a help to Miss Leyden and
  someone I would feel great confidence in
  having there
  Miss Moynagh would be a good worker
  humble + spiritual but not of the same character.
  More Miss Leydons type. As her teeth were all
  very bad, I advised her to have them all
  out. This she had done before Christmas. I
  am awaiting a letter from her in which she
  will tell me how soon she would be fit to
  go to Glenstal if I needed her
  Thank you very much for granting me

The material request I wrote about. I agree
with you in all you say on these matters

• feel just as you do about these money
  matters. I shall do as you request + hope you
  will also draw up your own ideal then we
  can discuss the whole question .
  Naturally I am sorry we shall not see
  you this month. hon The other hand for The College
  I am glad you are not leaving Glenstal so
  soon after The opening. Also this gives no
  all more time to pray + reflect over all matters
  so important only because they are dealing with
  Gods Eternal Will.
  I think till my return it is just as
  well to give my room to Miss Leydons
  companion that would leave Cook + Mai
  Mary + Miss Leydon. If you think it better
  to have Mary + Cook well + good or if
  you think Lizzie would like it + that it
  would do her good, she + Miss Leydon
  could share the front. room It is better for
  you + Matron to arrange this matter but
  certainly I prefer to have my room used
  it will make things more comfortable + healthy.
  Dear Father now I come to thank you for

what I must value, the special course of
instructions to my daughters, as you so nicely
put it, if you find it convenient + necessary
I shall of course have no objection to them being
increasid It is a excellent plan to allow
them to confere with Dom David for
explanations + counsel if they need them
I shall leave things reen as they did at the
end of last term till the companion arrives
then we shall maps out things for the two
(there is alway a little danger of a Matron
getting +putting in one thing after another on
Her work is not heavy as things are at Glenstal
at prisent) I have written to Matron stating
Miss Leyden returns but that it is absolutely
necessary she has certain + regular time for
her spiritual exercises
.
Like you. at present I feel overwhelmed
wrth responsibilities a religious life is such a
high ideal, we shall be united in prayer for
The same great end, our own individual
perfection + them that as wished by God in
Glenstal + the future M.M.Mr .
I shall not speak of your coming.
I am grieved to hear Dom Gerard has received
Lerch reports, certainly they were not from me
or any of my subjects. I am ashamed.